PERMANENT Contacts Database: Please enter your details

[Mark Prado]

Hello everyone,

Please enter your information here:

http://permanent.com/db-contacts.htm

If you are a forum participant, please enter your forum identity somewhere in the form, such as in the comments. I can link the two later.

In restarting PERMANENT, I'm finding that most of the email addresses I have from people in the past are no longer working, and I have no way to contact them, not even a phone number or a street address to send a postcard to. Actually, some phone numbers and geographical locations are in some emails somewhere, but those emails are needles in a haystack.

That is one reason for starting this PERMANENT Contacts Database.

There are many reasons for this database, as you can imagine.

Eventually, it will be so that people can find others with similar interests. For example, a professional researching about ways to mine an asteroid can see who else is working on this. Or, if you want to know more about a volunteer doing a lot of work and contact them, you can find them this way. This part of the software is not ready yet, and I need more people in the database so we can give it a test drive.

It will also mean that PERMANENT can keep track of the details of every entity in the space development field, as well as new volunteers.

Right now, this database is internal only. However, there's a question you will be prompted with, as to whether or not you want any of your details available publicly.

Email, phone number, and personal street address are NEVER published on a public website! However, if you want publicity for the rest of your information, or don't mind it accessed by other PERMANENT visitors, then you can choose a Public listing, which will display your name and whatever other information you post (except email, phone, and address). I think the form is fairly clear about what is published publicly and what is not. If you're not sure about something, then just leave that field blank for now, no worries.

The one big challenge is spammers and other troublemakers. As I've been running a lot of websites for a long time, I know that spammers don't bother with links which don't allow them to enter spam text. For example, if they go to somebody's record and click on the icon for "Contact this person", they cannot enter any text. It only sends the contactee a standard message saying that the contactor is trying to contact them, and sends the URL of the sender's profile on PERMANENT. Then, they can review that sender's profile and click on another link to approve an exchange of email addresses -- both ways. Before such an initial request can be made, both parties must be human verified, nothing automatic, whereby a real human reviews them before they are given the authorization level to send or receive any contact requests. Also, the sender must be logged in, of course.

Unless someone has a better idea.

All the best,
Mark Prado, founder

[Boxy]

Have you considered using social networking sites like Facebook to try to connect to people from the past? It may prove unfeasible for everyone, but critical contacts could be followed-up on in this way.

[Mark Prado]

These social networking sites are a great concept fundamentally, but I find them very poor for professional networking.

In proactively trying to use these social networking sites to find other people from the past, I haven't found Facebook, Linked-In, or other such sites very productive to date. Maybe it's just me, but when I search, unless they have a very unique name, I usually come up with a lot of people with the same name, yet not enough information is presented publicly to determine which one out of the long list is the person of interest. Maybe people are just paranoid about privacy.

I put up my own profile as a fishing hook a few months ago so people could find me, since my old email addresses are dead. In the few months I've been on Facebook, I've received contact requests from a lot of people who have apparently tried to contact the wrong Mark Prado, despite putting a photo of myself and more than enough info on my page to identify me (unlike so many other people who put so little on their pages so you can't get to know them or whether you even have the right person). Either that or I don't remember most of the people sending me friend requests. Of the half dozen friends requests I've approved, none are PERMANENT people.

I see many design shortcomings in these social networking sites. Fine for casual personal socializing, but fall flat for professional networking. I think they're popular because they fill a simple need for the masses, not advanced needs.

A big problem which has plagued these systems for the 22 years I've been online -- back to BBS SYSOP years -- is that people don't write enough about themselves on the web (or any network) to get to know them. Just a pretty picture and simple stuff.

I also find Facebook a bit demeaning. I just now went back to do a search and there's a big prominent box near the top right of the screen saying "No Uglies, Please" and some sort of profile search box, underneath it saying "Looking for good looking people? ... Uglies need not reply..." Like it's OK to not want to get to know somebody for their mind, only their appearance. (Mind you, I'm a nice looking guy, but others' interest and compliments mean practically nothing to me unless they are about the inside.)

It's this mainstream, lowest common denominator stuff -- garbage in, garbage out -- which really turns me off to a lot of these social networking sites.

My youngest staff use Facebook and some other social networking sites the most -- a lot!, but my older staff do not. That may say something... Maybe I don't find old PERMANENT people because they're older and don't use social networking sites much, or else they have the same experiences as me with these social networking sites.

(I also have limited sympathy for people who have relationship and marriage failures, who chose people for their looks rather than their personalities. And all the time they squander... and money... and someday, the "in love" feeling naturally wears off, the rose colored glasses are gone, and you have the real person right there stripped down to their mind. Best friend or not compatible?)

Anyway, speaking of social networking, this forum allegedly has some social networking capabilities, but I haven't explored those options much because they just don't jump out at me as being very easy to customize, but maybe I missed something. I didn't get it for its social networking capabilities, I got it because the company which makes it has kept developing it and appears the best for the future, too. The more you customize these things, the more you risk headaches when it's time to apply security patches and/or upgrades.

I've started a separate Contacts Database which has a slew of custom fields which I think is a lot more practical for keeping track of people. Just finished phase 1 of the programming last week -- the MySQL database, PHP front end, and a basic Admin control panel. After we get a few people in it, I will start work on the public search and list features of non-private information. I don't do the work myself, I just design it, give it to a programmer, take a look at the result, and tweak it.

Next time, I don't want to lose these people. I'm sure most of them will be back within the next year when they see PERMANENT alive again. After all, it's been nearly static for 7 years, and the contact form went to my old dead email address overloaded with spam. I have more than about a gigabyte of spam in a server backup file which maybe I could wade thru.

Let's try to come up with a good new system so history doesn't repeat itself, and the institution learns from experience and adapts.

Please add yourself here: http://www.permanent.com/db-contacts.htm

Any suggestions for additional fields could be useful.

Again, after you submit the form, you can't see the results because I don't have a public front end, but that will come next. I'm thinking of having people use their email address as username and then with a password they can edit their own record but otherwise can only view others' public profiles.

There's no photo upload capability. Should I add that? I guess it may help us recognize somebody at a physical conference, but instead of a photo I'd also appreciate a custom avatar which shows somebody's imagination, or even if the avatar is copied from somewhere, it still tells something about them on the inside. Different artistic strokes for different folks. Or the logo of their affiliation or somesuch.

[Phenix]

Hello Mark,

I am so glad to hear that we have common values. It is great ;)

Thanks,

Manuel

[Alexander Declama]

It's funny, I just ran a search for you on Facebook, the only results were web searches that brought up MarkPrado.com. I personally use Facebook but it's primarily social. I know too many people that put too much on their information on the Facebook pages and get themselves into trouble because you never know who's looking.

[Rhyshaelkan]

I never use my real name on facebook. And not to be a stalker either. I want people to know my work(s). Not me personally.

[Sam Fraser]

Call me old-fashioned, but Facebook etc. seems very much for bored or horny teens. I just cringe when I hear a business associate or someone in a professional field boast about their Facebook page. It's like watching a 35-year-old skateboard.

[joertexas]

Call me old-fashioned, but Facebook etc. seems very much for bored or horny teens. I just cringe when I hear a business associate or someone in a professional field boast about their Facebook page. It's like watching a 35-year-old skateboard.

There is also LinkedIn, which is a professional site.

JR

[Sam Fraser]

Yes, LinkedIn and the like aren't bad and have a point. Facebook and the like just seem so self-indulgent to me. I suppose it's time to put this old fossil in the museum where he belongs. :cool:

[prometheuspan]

i hope you will forgive me but at this point i'm not sure that we get along that well.

hit me up somewhere around post 200.

[Rhyshaelkan]

As long as everyone is respectful of each other. It will all go well.

[joertexas]

As long as everyone is respectful of each other. It will all go well.

Doees that mean we can't fling pies at each other anymore?

JR

[Rhyshaelkan]

*Rhy checks the rules*

Yup I think pies are in order. :P

[joertexas]

*Rhy checks the rules*

Yup I think pies are in order. :P

Rules? What rules? :D

JR

[sgeos]

Contacts Database: Brendan Sechter
Forum: sgeos
I hit send too soon on the database form, so it is only half filled out. It would be fantastic if there is some way for me to enter the remaining info and/or finish editing what I have started.

[Rhyshaelkan]

I am sure you can enter it again and/or PM Mark Prado to be on the lookout for a duplicate name. To take the form which is more completely filled out.

Welcome to the forum.

[Sam Fraser]

Contacts Database: Brendan Sechter
Forum: sgeos
I hit send too soon on the database form, so it is only half filled out. It would be fantastic if there is some way for me to enter the remaining info and/or finish editing what I have started.

Welcome to the boards, Brendan. Could you PM me with the remaining info and I'll ensure your entry is updated. I'll also see if we can make this editable in the near future (although at the moment we're without a programmer).

[Ommas]

In my opinion anything that broadens the appeal of the site is a good thing. I mean to say there are a lot of board folks out there. So don't ignore social media in my opinion. A bigger base has better odds of generating funds for future goals. Also regular folks are getting more informed, we need sites like these to help with the shift from state sponsored missions to industry access of space. I drift from the topic just a bit. Discoveries change the world, events shape our thoughts, information challenges us all to discover more. If we put 75 Einsteins on the radiation issues it wouldn't be long that privates would be creating wealth beyond earth gravity. I often see on gaming forums the game addicts mentioning how they should be doing something serious or could of made a difference instead just playing another round. Even gamers tend to gather on social media. The funny thing to me is when I try to talk about gleaning Resources from space. I get the omg I'm getting a phone call. I believe just as I wanted stop playing games and look very seriously at what is come after I die. Others to will stop being distracted as gaming is just fad like tv. Ok tv may not seem like a fad , but in time it will be seen as a very long fad that had few alternatives when visual media was state controlled.

My twisty point is it important to fill out contact info , yet it is also important to appeal to new crowds and link to other groups. My mind gets so foggy I so off topic --- I'll just blurt it out and see if it sticks.

Some bacteria characteristics change when acting individually or in small clusters , but when the numbers begin to abound the the characteristics change and sometimes kill their host. Like locust in small numbers behave differently large numbers and even become in a panic in swarms the become terrifyingly destructive. I believe we humans are similar . When we fear each other in great numbers we are switch into a creative panic . I don't dwell on doom , because it's built into nature as mass extinctions. While a mountain explodes enough survives to live on. We see it coming , but rather than fear it were trying to survive it. My original intent of posting on permanent was to see if I could understand where the opportunities weighed against the threats in the near term of space exploration and possible extinction of life.

What I believe is that if a major human die off event occurs , the threat is that there just won't be enough Einsteins working on radiation issues to thrive in space not just a humans ,but as whole ecosystems that can thrive amongst the solar winds scientifically not as just dreaming. Lol I really shouldn't post when sleepy.

My last point is. That social networking should help with finding some of those Einsteins. They are easier to find there as opposed to them finding us out of pure luck.

I can't thank you all enough for being polite about most of my nonsensical posts. I plan to focus on radiation and regolith processing, because in my opinion if the moon can't be made to be terraformed into creating plant food for earth crops then a die event of 80% of all life on earth in the next 300 years. Of course my number are frivolous. I believe not enough people are aware of unsustainable uses of arable land and the fertilizers we will eventually run out of. Natural organic farming just isnt going sustain 15 billion if the whole world is armed. What most humans don't know is is how plentiful organics are in the solar system. From here my mind just goes fictional thinking such as genetically modified ecosystems that create food sources beyond earth, or leave humans mark on life it's self with blueprint genetic codes in compounds that can travel across the galaxy .;);)

[Rhyshaelkan]

We are all here because, in one way or another, we get excited about space. However PERMANENT stands for Projects in the Near Term. So "tech around the corner", or "I have a plan to have domed cities on the Moon" are a touch away from what we want need. Thus we distill down to some missions like Joe's Moonshot.